Norp the Yorp I level design

Discussion and analysis of graphics, story, levels, and so on.
EricMushroomWilson
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Post by EricMushroomWilson »

This is quite an ordered level. The long drop down from the start actually kind of reminds me of the first level of the Four Golden Crystals mod, although the rest of the level isn't really similar.

The use of the doors in this level is in the "all doors next to each other blocking exit, keys in various places in the level" sort of style, rather than having doors at different points and a key needed to progress past each door and get to the part with the next door/key.

I'm not sure if I can recall many uses of this in the original Keen games, but it actually sort of vaguely reminds me of the use of the gem gates in the map level of Jill Saves the Prince. Except the gems aren't colour coded and all that.

Some of the "going up to get a yorp doll" parts are a bit monotonous, I think. Maybe a bit of variation in platforms could help?

There's a message in the level, does anyone know what it says? I'm not sure if I've completed this level.

I like the use of different-coloured blocks for the different areas/routes. Adds to the ordered feel of the level, I think.

A few points along the bottom floor area of the level might be good...
xtraverse
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Post by xtraverse »

Wow, I never thought people would be talking about this mod 5 years later...
EricMushroomWilson
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Post by EricMushroomWilson »

Hmm, I'd just like to add that they I just found out they did actually use that style of a bunch of doors next to the exit and needing to go around the level and get the keys at least once in the official Keen games.

I was looking at level maps for Keen 1 and saw the doors used that way in level 13.
Stealthy71088
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Post by Stealthy71088 »

Feel free to comment on your levels Xtraverse. I'm very interested in what you have to say.
xtraverse
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Post by xtraverse »

Sure, I'll add comments when I have something interesting to say.

I don't think I ever actually thought about how much points I was putting in a level, I just sort of scattered them haphazardly.
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XkyRauh
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Post by XkyRauh »

Hey, we all have a first mod somewhere. :) Don't sweat the points. At least you give your players extra lives!

I think this level is a good example of linear fetch questing. Each one of the paths to a key is a straight line of platform jumping with nothing but tile-based dangers along the way. There's no real change in direction, and there's a long pause between sections because of the return time involved.

In this particular level, I think the trick would be to widen it, shorten the vertical climbing sections, and add some breaks of horizontal travel--that gives opportunity for other dangers, and even enemies. The huge side-quest for the Yorp Doll seems completely unnecessary, and could be a good opportunity for unique scenery, or removed entirely.

This level does good things, too--I don't want to be all negative. As pointed out, the definitive use of color helps structure the level, and the consistent use of the blocks makes for an environmentally stable level. This level trims the diagonally-shaded blocks down to single-width platforms, but it strongly reinforces the square blocks as divisive and the green ribbons as structural. I continue to be impressed with the environmental consistency in this mod! :)
Stealthy71088
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Post by Stealthy71088 »

My first thought is the color. I really like how colorful this level is!

My second thought is that while parts of this level are lots of fun- (look at all the yorps), other parts are simply boring. There's too much repition (jump up, avoid this obstacle. Jump up, avoid that obstacle.) It's great for introducing kill tiles, but if you die twice and have to redo the level each time, it gets really annoying.

i really like the red section of the level, with all the gargs. The gargs are very effective there, and it can be tricky (yet fun) if you're a newbie to Keen.

I also like the drop in the beginning. Keen doesn't die on getting to the bottom, so it's both kind of cool and refreshing.

I wished the points were scattered around the level a bit more- the way it looks now, it seems as if we have social classes!

There are a lot of shots in this level. 40 more than needed! I would drop this by at least 20, maybe 25.

I would probably twist all four paths together if I could, and make a little maze.

And now

Level 3 (by map)

Look at all the yellow!!!

Stealthy's Notes
-all the yellow makes the lasers hard to see. It's easy to die.
-There's a puzzle element in here- how do you get through all the lasers alive?
-The second yellow key is a little unprotected in comparison to the other key
-There are no rayguns and one garg
-The yorps can really kill in this level if you aren't careful. This level teaches you that sometimes, you have to kill half dead yorps.
Stealthy's Questions

Code: Select all

-Is the fact that all the blocks and the laser are all yellow too annoying?
-should a raygun be added?
-should the second yellow key be better protected? how?
Dont be afraid to give "shocking" comments!
-Stealthy71088
xtraverse
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Post by xtraverse »

In retrospect, I should have placed a Vorticon in the chamber with the second yellow key. And yeah, a raygun or two would've been a good idea. I'm glad the puzzle element came through though, that was my intention.
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XkyRauh
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Post by XkyRauh »

I'm always a fan of color-coordinated levels, and I think it's great that Xtraverse put two Yellow doors here, rather than one yellow and one other. I've never had the guts to do that in my own levels. :)

This level looks like it was designed with a slower paced feel on purpose--I'm glad there's no Vorticon anywhere... This level demands concentration, but it is not hard at all--just something that requires focus.

I like that the checkerboard layout of platforms is never misaligned or interrupted, though I wouldn't mind seeing some solids or missing blocks. The wide open air between the checkerboard and the cordoned off section in the upper right helps give the level character without being overwhelming.

I very rarely say this, but I think an Ice Cannon might be nice near the second Yellow keygem... Especially if it pointed up and right, returning the player to the steps down, rather than killing them.

My only real complaint with the level would be the abundance of cake. I don't mind platforms in checkerboards like this, but points should always have a bit more of an artsy layout to them.
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CommanderSpleen
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Post by CommanderSpleen »

One thing that jumps out at me about this level is those T-platforms down the bottom right, and the top-left. Their design indicates they're resting on something, and it just looks weird floating in mid-air. They make great scenery on their own, but overuse turns them into an eyesore, IMKO.

I agree with the cake sentiment. Again they look to be scenery filler to make up for the relative lack of backdrop objects. A modular diagonal background tile would've gone great to replace all those items on the right. Less items in general would make things much cosier.

I'd be inclined to tidy up the right hand side; make that pyramid smaller, make the shaft a bit wider and bring the entry down to the base of the pyramid, and clear up those T platforms.

Also, just for the sake of it, it would be tempting to remove the bottom row of tiles under the laser in the middle, and definitely make an extra gap or so in the hovering platforms to make that key slightly more challenging (actually, a T platform would go well to rest the gem on).

I do like the yellow theme, especially with that blue backdrop. And a raygun wouldn't go astray.
EricMushroomWilson
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Post by EricMushroomWilson »

I kind of like the use of almost all yellow, although it does make the lasers a bit hard to see. It looks to me like the level involves a lot of tricky movement, and I think that's fine now and again but can grow irritating if the player dies repeatedly and has to do it all again.

The checkerboard effect is quite well-done. I think I agree that the T-shaped platforms look like they should be standing on some solid ground.

The second yellow key is quite a lot easier to get, but that's not always necessarily a bad thing. It could be a welcome reprieve after the tricky maneuvering in the earlier sections. If it was decided to make it harder to get, though, I'd suggest some spikes or other kill tiles on the floors on the way down to the key.

Apologies for the somewhat lateness of my response.
Stealthy71088
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Post by Stealthy71088 »

It's actually very easy to get past the lasers. If you stick to the left wall, there will only be one laser for you to avoid. i like puzzles like that, that look complicated, but turn out to be very simple.

Alternatively to the vorticon, a guard bot might be nice next to the second yellow key. It might also be good if the tiles there also had a 2 layered, checkered pattern, with lasers going through the bottom layer of tiles. This would create some uneven footing. You could then add a garg or two on the bottom, or a vorticon for a real challenge.

Level 4 or 5 or 6 (see map)

It's a small level with some definite possibilites. This level is so small, I mixed the notes and questions.

Stealthy's Notes And Questions

Code: Select all

-What is the effect of having small levels in the middle of a mod like this?
-If Norp just sits there, the garg will go right off the screen. How would you redesign this level? (Would you?)
-That point section on the bottom of the level is deadly. Any comments on it's deadliness?
Even though it's a small level, the positions of the sprites and kill tiles make it interesting.
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XkyRauh
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Post by XkyRauh »

Personally, I think this level does exactly what a level of its size should do: It offers expert players a chance at a higher score, and it offers novice players an easy victory. If Norp started on the lower of the two platforms he's over, there'd be more chance of the Garg charging, depending on how quick Norp was to jump up. I like the layout as it is... I'm always a fan of tiny levels.

If I were going to change something, I might make the level two screens wide, expanding the floating platform segment a bit. There's not enough room for a keycard, but we can at least put a few additional alternate routes in.

Again, notice how uniform the green walls' design is--two tiles thick, very well defined. :)
EricMushroomWilson
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Post by EricMushroomWilson »

I think this level's pretty much fine as it is. The occasional small level is good to change up the pace and tone of the game once in a while. There were quite a few small levels in Keen 1, if I remember correctly.

It does have the T things floating in midair again, although I guess they're supposed to they still kind of look like they should be resting on something.
Stealthy71088
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Post by Stealthy71088 »

The next level

This level introduces the player to the guard bot and the cave man. It's actually tougher than it looks, because the time it takes to play with the bot gives the cave man time to move closer to the jump throughable grey bricks. Norp has to try to lure the cave man away, and then move quickly.

My only question that I can come up with at the moment about the level is this: Does the position of the sprites overly complicate the level? Or should they be spread out more, so as not to trap Norp in between them?
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